Coyote + twins + E85 = timing?

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  1. #1
    Senior Member Array wiplash's Avatar
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    Default Coyote + twins + E85 = timing?

    For now this will be a stock longblock car, I'm hoping I don't hurt it long enough to get a couple of summers out of it.

    The turbo kit is On3's and I'm undecided as to whether I'm switching out the On3 60's for billet Precision 57's. I need to do some research on the turbine side of both to see if it'll be worth it.

    I'm going to run about 9lb's, JPC/CPE triple hat with two 465lph pumps, rails, convert it to return style with with -8 feed/-6 return, and ID1000 injectors.

    Exhaust will be an On3 off road x pipe, Pypes M80 cat-back, and the wastegates vented to the atmosphere.

    I tuned my last my car (a 737whp turbo 2V) myself with the PRP and will do the same with this one. My biggest concern is timing! I ran my 2V anywhere from 13* to 16* with 9.6:1 compression and 20+lb's of boost.


    Can anyone suggest a good starting point?

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  3. #2
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    Good luck sounds like any awsome build. Keep us updated.

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    Senior Member Array Dysan's Avatar
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    I know there is no way to compare since the coyote is 11:1 and 4V, but I have been running 21 degrees of timing on my 10.3:1 compression 3V on E85 and I'm about to go up to 23 degrees of timing. This is going up to 16-17psi of boost with my edelbrock tvs blower which gets some high IAT's at that boost. Since you're looking only at 9lbs of boost and if you have a good air to air cooling setup I think you could run 23-25 degrees of timing without any issue and will probably be making stupid power at that low boost. I hope you are putting in some TSS billet gears in the oil pump.

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    Senior Member Array mtrsprt's Avatar
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    17-24* depending on fuel. With e85, you could easily run 23-25* at 9psi. My 12psi street tune runs about 16-17* on 93. With 100+ octane, I can bump up to 24* all day long.....

  7. #5
    Senior Member Array wiplash's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtrsprt View Post
    17-24* depending on fuel. With e85, you could easily run 23-25* at 9psi. My 12psi street tune runs about 16-17* on 93. With 100+ octane, I can bump up to 24* all day long.....
    Sounds good, thanks!

    As far as the oil pump gears, has it been determined if rpm is killing the stock gears? I was going to setup the shift points under 7K.

  8. #6
    Senior Member Array mtrsprt's Avatar
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    TBH, I didn't even know there was an oil pump gear issue.

  9. #7
    Senior Member Array Dysan's Avatar
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    Same gear issue that the 05-10's had. The metal used in for the gears is brittle (I don't think cast but that pressed powder that some pistons are made with) and the gears can shatter if you get on and off the gas rapidly/frequently.

  10. #8

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    19psi with 10.76 compression and e85. Currently at 21 degrees but could go higher. Self tuning here too. I didn't really have a guideline to follow for e85 tuning but I'll share what I've done, right or wrong.

    Took the gas tune and changed stoich to reflect the fuel. That was the base tune. I can't remember everything else when developing the final tune but my mbt spark is basically 5 degrees higher across the board. The knock table is obviously higher too but it didn't go 5 degrees everywhere, a little more thought was put into it. Cold start and cold motor driveability will take some experimentation but it's possible to get those parameters pretty close to stock like.

    The first time I switched from gas to e85 and changed only the stoich the motor still gained around 45rwhp. It's a great fuel and now that I have higher compression the difference in fuel usage is only about 18% vs gasoline when supercharged.

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