Turbo Engine Re-Build - Page 7

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  1. #91

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    Also got these Gems in the mail! Thanks again Ed! Hope I got room to mount them!!!!
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  3. #92

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    Quote Originally Posted by CrucialProspect View Post
    Iím starting today assembling the rods, going to use pipe cleaners to clean out the oil passages and blowing them out with compressed air.
    Hopefully by tomorrow I can get the rings filed and assemble the short block.

    It really looks like these rods can be facing both directions, should I just make sure they are all facing the same direction by using the bearing tangs as reference? If so, should they face the front or the rear, or each other?

    Any special considerations for assembling the rods?

    They can (because they are on center rods) but it is better if they don't. Look at the big ends of the rods. Each side will be chamfered. One side will have a heavier chamfer. The side with the heavier chamfer goes towards the outside of the crank pin it rides on.


    Ed

  4. #93

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    Quote Originally Posted by CrucialProspect View Post
    Also got these Gems in the mail! Thanks again Ed! Hope I got room to mount them!!!!
    That is the best remote, available today, I know of Matt both in terms of the filter it uses and also the all important built in priming pump. The first time you use the priming pump you will never want a different system. Put a hex driver onto an electric drill, pull the trigger and you will wonder why no one has not offered this sooner. Be sure to use a powerful enough drill. Pumping oil will cause a weak drill motor to grunt.


    Ed

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  6. #94

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    Filing rings today, got crank installed.

    I’m shooting for .024 ring gap what is the recommended margin of error here?

    1-15 psi is .019
    15-30 psi is .024
    30+is .028

    I have some over filed rings.... first timer. I had a hard time getting used to the top and second ring hardness. I have 1 ring that are .028-.030 and 2 2nd rings in the same range. Toss them and get more or just run them?

  7. #95

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    If the engine was being used in a race only application I would replace the rings that had big gaps. This engine is predominately street with eclectic trips to the track ó if I am right. In that case put them in and be careful as you do the rest.



    Ed


    p.s. I put my street rings in at 0.025 top and 0.020 second. I am using AP steel tops and Napier cut cast iron seconds. Boost is 18psi.

  8. #96

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    It’s strictly a track car, new rings on the way. I can’t fully express how pleased I am with Gibtec after sales service!

  9. #97

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    Isn't this thing runnin' yet??

    ks

  10. #98

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    Quote Originally Posted by CrucialProspect View Post
    Itís strictly a track car, new rings on the way. I canít fully express how pleased I am with Gibtec after sales service!

    You read the tea leaves correctly, Matt, definte ring replacement situation.

    I know what you mean about Gibtec. It was one of the reasons I went to them for the piston design. Exceptional is one of the first adjectives that comes to mind when I think of them.


    Ed

  11. #99
    Senior Member Array RussZTT's Avatar
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    Little FYI. When you file your rings, make sure there are NO edges on any sides of the side of the ring you filed. You want to make sure after you install the rings in the ring lands that they move in and out freely, no hangs or snags. I too filed my top and 2nd rings at .028 but Iíll be around 35+ psi.

  12. #100

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    What are some pointers for locating ring opening position on the pistons? I had planned on the top ring at 12 o’clock and second ring at 6 o’clock. I just figured to keep them from being online, and keep the gaps away from the wrist pins, but didn’t know how important that was.

    Are the support rails, oil scraper, and both oil rings as important in positioning?

    Also, are the gaps in the oil scraper, rings, and support rail important? I noticed the rings above and below had a minimum gap of .015 called out, but none on the actual oil ring. Also, the support rails are compressed, so it’s pretty hard to measure them.

    Good advice to file all corners on the rings, don’t need any sharp edges to score up the sleeve, or piston.

    How hard are the rings to install? I planned on using a flat billed ring expander, but didn’t know how easy these were due to the material and thickness. Thanks for all the help so far!

  13. #101

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    There are multiple ring positioning preferences. There are a few things to remember. Once the engine starts all the rings rotate and at different speeds. Best advice is put it together with the ring gaps evenly spaced on the top two and 180 apart on the oil rails. Do not line up the expander parting line with any of the oil rail gaps. Use one of the billet piston ring compressors sized for your engine's bore size. If you call total seal they will make it to any bore size you want for about $35 or $40 if I recall correctly.

    Using a tapered bilet ring compressor with some lube, the pistons will literally slide in with the push of your thumbs at 3 and 9 o'clock on the pistons. Keep the ring compressor flat and square to the block deck.


    Ed

  14. #102

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    Thanks Ed. I would like to point out another potential issue I have yet on the main studs. The larger inner studs have a tapered thread, in which the nut engages the larger portion as it’s torqued down.

    The issue I have is just a few threads of engagement on the stud itself. Simple fix, you would un-thread the mainstud to get the nut to fully engage the thread, but then you would be loosing the integrity of the stud threading into the block.

    Which is the lesser of two evils here? I was able to get the nut torqued down, but it’s only threaded 2/3 the way on the nut.

  15. #103

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    Because pictures are worth a thousand words...Name:  837B4B3D-8591-45EA-8050-AB1D31F03B2A_1581063162952.jpg
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    You can see the longer studs at the center, the nut has cleared the smaller 8mm thread, but has only 4 or so threads on the 10mm section.
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    If this is indeed a problem like I deduce, would it be safe to back out the main studs a few turns in order to maximize thread engagement of the nut, while not sacrificing the thread engagement depth in the block itself. And if so, what’s the best way to do so? Should I loosen all the mains and side bolts, run them out a few turns and re-torque to specs in sequence? Or would doing one single stud at a time in any particular order suffice?

    Also, is there any reason the shorter 8mm studs on the caps have washers and not the 10mm studs? Would simply removing the washers on the 10mm studs gain sufficient headspace for what I need?

  16. #104

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    You need to have washers under both the inner and outer nuts. The reason you have the minimal thread engagement with the nuts is the hole depth in the main web. Someone drilled and/or tapped it deeper than it was specified in the Ford design docs for the block. I would remove the nuts and put washers on all studs. Spin the nuts down finger tight and then, using an Allen wrench back the stud out until it has two threads of stud above the top of the nut. With two threads of stud above the nut, begin to tighten the nuts once again in Ford's recommended sequence. You should be OK.

    If you want, you can play with ball bearing sizes looking for a size you can drop in each stud hole to provide a positive stop for the stud as you initially install the studs in the block. The ball bearing is not used to provide an object to torque the stud against. It is only intended to provide a uniform positive stop as you hand install each stud so you don't need to back each stud out however many turn are necessary to get your two threads above the top of the nut after torquing.

    The total thread engagement with two threads above the top of the nut is precisely what you want to shoot for. It will give you more than adequate thread engagement in the block. Something to consider is, if the stud wells have had the threads chased to the bottom of the stud well using a cutting tap, whoever did that potentially took material out of the block if they used a cutting tap. That potentially weakens the thread in the block. If they did you will be able to tell as you torque the nuts on the studs. The torque wrench will not come up to the torque value with a positive crisp click. The torquing process will have a spongy feel to the fastener coming up to its torque spec.


    Ed


    p.s. Always use ARP UltraTorque and do not get it on the underside of the washers
    Last edited by eschaider; 02-07-2020 at 03:54 AM.

  17. #105

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    Good advice with the bearings, sounds a lot like I’ll be loosening all the studs and re-torquing them! I didn’t figure I’d get it right the first time, it seems like without knowing where they bottom out on a positive stop you’d never know where the threads would land on the nut. I also have to dig through my old parts to make sure my oil pickup stud will thread onto the end of the one main studs. Thanks again!

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