Go th400-especially if you have big time hp, but the c4 does quite well -ask jake and harold they have won 2 of the 4 shootouts with c4's . If you go c4 ck out dynamic/lupo transmissions-c4 is lighter, easier to install and remove it,esp with headers
TH400 or C4?
Before I get blasted for posing this question, I have read through a lot of posts on here about this subject. Most of what I read has been from a a couple of years ago. I 'm debating replacing my T56 Magnum with an auto and would like some input from some of you guys that have done your swaps so I can make the most educated decision on this. I'm a firm believer in not re-inventing the wheel and learning from others experience so I appreciate any advice you guys have.
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They both cost about the same, but the c4 will break!
Thanks for the replies guys. I've tried to follow Jake's build pretty closely since he did such a good job of documenting his progression. Very impressive car there.
That's the kind of information I'm looking for there as far as difficulty in dropping it, installation, durability, and performance. I'm at 626hp and 546tq right now on 16lbs from a Kenne Bell 2.6. I also have a wet nitrous kit installed so I have the option of spraying it, although I have not done so yet. I'm still feeling out the new setup and trying to get it dialed in. In the near future I'll bump the boost up to 22 lbs. So, I'm looking for something pretty stout that I won't have to fix after every track day.
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showme cobra,
Do you have a recommended vendor for the Th400 setup? Also, does anyone have an all inclusive swap or will I have to piece one together?
That's the kind of information I'm looking for there as far as difficulty in dropping it, installation, durability, and performance. I'm at 626hp and 546tq right now on 16lbs from a Kenne Bell 2.6. I also have a wet nitrous kit installed so I have the option of spraying it, although I have not done so yet. I'm still feeling out the new setup and trying to get it dialed in. In the near future I'll bump the boost up to 22 lbs. So, I'm looking for something pretty stout that I won't have to fix after every track day.
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showme cobra,
Do you have a recommended vendor for the Th400 setup? Also, does anyone have an all inclusive swap or will I have to piece one together?
Equally built, the TH400 will cost you a good bit more money to build but it will be more reliable. Done right, C4s don't break. They are small and the small clutches just wear out faster. If you're unlucky, you may crack the case but a 30 year old case will do that on occasion. I've beaten the living hell out of mine for over 4 years and made hundreds of passes. I've cracked 1 case (internals were mint) and I've had it out twice to replace high gear clutches. At my level, it's a 40-50 pass life span at this point, but we're talking a lot of HP. With most of my racing being 1/8th mile, I bet I can get a little more out of it.
For a turbo car making the steam they do, or a heavy car that sees street time too, the 400 is the way to go. A C4 works well when the weight of the car is in check (3300 or less) and at 700whp or less, it will take a LOT. Any more than that and you have to understand the maintenance that will be needed.
It's not rocket science. A bigger, beefier trans will take more and last longer. It just has to be the right application to get the most out of it. Some of us class race and weight is critical.
For a turbo car making the steam they do, or a heavy car that sees street time too, the 400 is the way to go. A C4 works well when the weight of the car is in check (3300 or less) and at 700whp or less, it will take a LOT. Any more than that and you have to understand the maintenance that will be needed.
It's not rocket science. A bigger, beefier trans will take more and last longer. It just has to be the right application to get the most out of it. Some of us class race and weight is critical.
What kind of power does your combo make.Equally built, the TH400 will cost you a good bit more money to build but it will be more reliable. Done right, C4s don't break. They are small and the small clutches just wear out faster. If you're unlucky, you may crack the case but a 30 year old case will do that on occasion. I've beaten the living hell out of mine for over 4 years and made hundreds of passes. I've cracked 1 case (internals were mint) and I've had it out twice to replace high gear clutches. At my level, it's a 40-50 pass life span at this point, but we're talking a lot of HP. With most of my racing being 1/8th mile, I bet I can get a little more out of it.
For a turbo car making the steam they do, or a heavy car that sees street time too, the 400 is the way to go. A C4 works well when the weight of the car is in check (3300 or less) and at 700whp or less, it will take a LOT. Any more than that and you have to understand the maintenance that will be
It's not rocket science. A bigger, beefier trans will take more and last longer. It just has to be the right application to get the most out of it. Some of us class race and weight is critical.
Th400 here and I've never had it out going on 4, maybe 5 years. My car weighs around 3600 pounds and I drive/race it on the street quite often.
You gentlemen's opinions are confirming for me what I had suspected. It's sounds a lot like the TH400 route is the way to go. I see there are some preferred vendors mentioned for the C4, but which vendor have you all had the most luck with as far as getting a TH400 swap? I've read JW has an adapter that they make. I prefer, if possible to do one stop shopping and be able to get a complete unit from the same place. Suggestion? And once again, thank you for taking the time to respond to my questions on here. I'm sure some of you guys hear them all the time but, that's what happens when you own the fastest Mustangs around. 
626hp / 546tq as of right now. That's on 16lbs boost, no nitrous. I do have a nitrous kit installed. I just haven't sprayed it yet. Also will be running higher boost on a different tune later.What kind of power does your combo make.
i would go with a turbo 400 and dont look back...with all the different turbo 400 1st gear options...
Historically the JW bell-housing has been among the best ways to connect the trans to various engines, including ours. Today there are aftermarket cases for the TH-400 that allow for a more secure attachment. This is a picture of a Reid case and bell-housing for a ModMotor TH-400;
![Automotive lighting Bicycle part Font Headlamp Automotive exhaust]()
Notice how the bell housing has its own anchor points built into the transmission case. Reid makes bell-housings for almost every engine you can think of, including a ModMotor. One of the nice touches is the bell housing also bolts right up to their aftermarket powerglide case.
ATI also has a comparable offering;
![Cylinder Auto part Bicycle part Gas Engineering]()
Like the Reid solution the ATI bell housing will work with either their TH-400 or powerglide solutions. Each provider has slightly different approaches to fixing the tender center support case lugs found on OEM cases. Both are impressive upgrades for high power applications.
Ed
Notice how the bell housing has its own anchor points built into the transmission case. Reid makes bell-housings for almost every engine you can think of, including a ModMotor. One of the nice touches is the bell housing also bolts right up to their aftermarket powerglide case.
ATI also has a comparable offering;
Like the Reid solution the ATI bell housing will work with either their TH-400 or powerglide solutions. Each provider has slightly different approaches to fixing the tender center support case lugs found on OEM cases. Both are impressive upgrades for high power applications.
Ed
Wow, thanks Ed. Great info! Now does Reid make just the case, or could I get a whole setup through them. It looks like I could get the case with internals through ATI but I REALLY like the way that Reid case looks. It looks pretty beefy.
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Well, I guess Google was made for a reason, lol. I looked them up and am checking out their site now.
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Well, I guess Google was made for a reason, lol. I looked them up and am checking out their site now.
Just got done checking out the Reid website. That is definitely the case I want. Just wish this was Monday instead of Sunday so I could give them a call today!
Wow, thanks Ed. Great info! Now does Reid make just the case, or could I get a whole setup through them. It looks like I could get the case with internals through ATI but I REALLY like the way that Reid case looks. It looks pretty beefy.
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Well, I guess Google was made for a reason, lol. I looked them up and am checking out their site now.
Take it easy Mike, we need you to last through the weekend to buy the toys. :grin:Just got done checking out the Reid website. That is definitely the case I want. Just wish this was Monday instead of Sunday so I could give them a call today!
That I am aware of Reid just makes the hard parts. Your builder of choice (including you) does the actual assembly work. ATI will sell you a finished unit however. Both are excellent manufacturers and product offerings.
Ed
Doesn't the stock th400 case handles well over 1500hp without issues?
Thanks again Ed, I'm counting to 10 now.........I can wait until Monday. LOLYou know the worst part is I just put a brand new T56 Magnum in the car about 2 months before I deployed earlier this year. The car sat for 7 months, I've been back and driving it for about 2 months and it kills me to see guys making less power than I am running faster times with the autos. So, I'm gonna jump ship to the auto club. I love rowing through the gears but, I've got another car I can do that on anyway if I ever get around to putting it back together.
Which branch you in Mike and thanks for your service.Thanks again Ed, I'm counting to 10 now.........I can wait until Monday. LOLYou know the worst part is I just put a brand new T56 Magnum in the car about 2 months before I deployed earlier this year. The car sat for 7 months, I've been back and driving it for about 2 months and it kills me to see guys making less power than I am running faster times with the autos. So, I'm gonna jump ship to the auto club. I love rowing through the gears but, I've got another car I can do that on anyway if I ever get around to putting it back together.
Ed
The transmission on balance is impressively strong y2k2gt. The stock case design has tender center support lugs. Lots of them put in long service without difficulty while others do not. Both ATI and Reid's recognized the shortcoming and took steps to improve the design rather than carry forward a weaker OEM design. It's the same basic approach as the bell-housing's attaching points . The new cases use purpose built lugs and attaching points, the OEM cases in transplants attach to smaller fasteners the factory originally intended for other matters.Doesn't the stock th400 case handles well over 1500hp without issues?
Ed
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