200 shot

start with the basics, better air intake, better exhaust, better ignition, better fuel intake

 

Long tubes, u/d pulleys, short runner intake, regular bolt on stuff and a tune. You'll still be on the low side of what you're shooting for.

 

Long tubes, short runner intake, regular bolt on stuff and a tune. You'll still be on the low side of what you're shooting for.

 

This is in a Mark VIII correct ? Using a stock 96 mustang cobra intake , kooks MK8 headers and a vortech S trim and tune and I made 355 rwhp on stock 94 MK8 longblock with 120K miles through the 4r70w. way back in the beginning...

 

How much boost? He said N/A btw

 

Save your money

Save your money you are not going to reach these HP numbers NA. Not going to happen. Go Boost and you will reach upper 300s. See http://www.markviii.org/LOD2/ for help. Several members have gone with Vortech SC, but it is mainly a custom install and expensive.

Glenn Ford

 

Save your money you are not going to reach these HP numbers NA. Not going to happen. Go Boost and you will reach upper 300s. See http://www.markviii.org/LOD2/ for help. Several members have gone with Vortech SC, but it is mainly a custom install and expensive.

Glenn Ford

Glenn,

With all due respect, I beg to differ on that opinion. I know of at least one Lincoln and lots of 4V 4.6's that make 300+ WHP NA. If you will recall a couple weeks ago back in the Georgia shootout there was a Blue Lincoln Mark VIII there running in the 13.4 range @ 103-104 MPH. That is the "Blue Flame" and Driller driving!

That car is a bolt on High Mileage Mark VIII that is NA and has just had the Heads and cams done on the car. We've yet to see what kind of actual power numbers on the dyno but its easily picked up 3-4 MPH in the quarter since the install. That takes a lot of HP with a 4K lb car. Previous to that swap on stock heads and cams it was making nearly 270 HP at the wheels. I would bet its making well over 300+ HP at the wheels now.

I'll keep you posted as he gets a new tune and dyno numbers before spring. That car will run 12's on motor come spring time. It's already gone 13.1's in cool air previously.

As far as the N20 comments. My 2v with a Dry 125 shot made 350 WHP and 503 Tq, I expect the same shot would make considerably more on a 4V. I also don't have belt issues!

 

Familiar with Mark VIII Engines

I am familar with Mark VIII engine builds and I have been a member of the Mark VIII forum for years. Cams and heads will not get you anywhere near 350 HP. Many members have gone down this road with limited success. The money would have been much better spent toward a SC Vortech. Sorry, but it is just not going to happened.

Glenn Ford

 

An update on the Lincolns Progress

I am familar with Mark VIII engine builds and I have been a member of the Mark VIII forum for years. Cams and heads will not get you anywhere near 350 HP. Many members have gone down this road with limited success. The money would have been much better spent toward a SC Vortech. Sorry, but it is just not going to happened.

Glenn Ford

Glenn,

As of Saturday, JP (Driller) had the "Blue Flame" Lincoln dyno tuned on a "Mustang Dyno" if my memory serves me correctly. His stock NA 100+K mile 4V 4.6L shortblock with a set of ported heads, cams and ported intake made a best of 316 RWHP and 330+ RWTQ according to him, prior to subsequent runs and heat soak. I had stated I'd post the numbers after he had it dynoed.

Pretty decent numbers if you ask me. Maybe not 350 HP but thats pretty decent!
Maybe he can elaborate on his set up as far as the cams, heads and such. I know they are a relatively mild set of cams and 4V lincoln heads.

I expect we'll see that car in the 12's this season NA.

 

I'm familiar with them too! The Cobra version and the Lincolns.

I'm not saying you are easily going to get 350WHP out of them but the original poster stated between 300 & 350WHP. It is very possible to get 300+ and not that difficult at that with the right combination of parts. Heads and cams are roughly half the cost of a good supercharger set up! The problem is most with those cars tend to not go that route.

When driller gets his dyno numbers I will post them up.

BTW, have you had that Marauder back on the track since the SSHS?

 

Well... times change.

I hope to soon have both - a Vortech'd '96 Mark VIII as well as the N/A version in the '93 Blue Flame.

I am convinced the '96 will never be as fast as the '93, even with the S-trim Vortech. Even further, I am certain the '93 is not at full potential...

...yet. :bigwink:

 

Good Luck ==

Good luck with the Marks and the Cougar NA. The debate on spending thousands on increasing the HP of a 4.6 4v NA has been a hot topic on the MM as well as the CV boards for over a year. The bottom line continues to be it just is not worth the time and effort to put big money into a NA 4v (or even a 2v) to increase the HP over 300 HP. I pushed my 4v to 298 HP and called it quits and put my money into a SC and went from 13.9 to 11.8 sec. Many people have put large sums of money into their NA with diminshing results. It just is not worth the time and effort. You cannot beat the results of a SC.

The black stallion is put-up for the winter. I accomplished my goal of running 11.80. I will now shoot for 11.7s next year. All on a stock internal engine in a heavy car running FRPP Cobra shorty headers and X-pipe to stock mufflers and tail pipes, a Trilogy SC, K&N CAI, a SCT tune, and 4:10s - that's it.

Glenn Ford

 

I certainly agree with the 'diminishing results' theory running naturally aspirated. Every tenth of a second gain certainly seems to be exponentially more costly.

But, like beauty... 'worth' is in the eye of the beholder. :bigwink:

 

completely agree with everything said here....im building a N/A 2V 4.6.....14:1 compression, ported heads, big cams, etc, etc.....have I sunk large amounts of money that could have gone to a blower instead?.....Yup.....but i'm one of those hardheaded nuts that just likes the idea of making power N/A, so its definitely worth it to someone like me

 

i helped andy at crossroads performance do a 97 cobra had cams a shortrunner(1 1/2") flat tops and a good valve job made 382 to the wheels with a t45 so should be close to 350 with a 4r70

 

 

Nice vid :tip:

 

What would it take to be able to put down 300-350 RWHP N/A using the 4r70w ??
I am very new to mods and I have so many questions about them so I thought I would start here! I thought it seemed like a good realistic number to shoot for. Please no answers like a "100 shot"

Thanks guys
JohnnyJ

Well the Mark heads and cams will have to go. You are far better off with C heads, 96-98 cobra cams and a 99/01 Cobra or Mach intake. You would essentially end up with a Marauder or automatic Mach 1 engine. With a small boost in compression and some good tuning you would be in the 330 range with some great torque.

 

The question has been answer but ya, with a cobra intake, a set of cams and exhaust you could hit 300.

IMO It would be way easier to just swap a 03/04 cobra motor to make the power.

Still even if you just do a cobra intake and exhuast, if you have the j mod, a nice stall and gears...the car will be pretty quick from a dig.

 

Tis true!

However, I'd love to see what a blower set up would do on that combo you have on the "Blue Flame".

I know one thing, with the components in place and that on top it certainly would be one viscious ride 4K+ lbs or not. LOL!

 

Man, you're quick! LOL :laugh:

Yeah, the bottom end is stock and has 141K on the clock. The heads are ported by Fox Lake and the cams are custom Bullet cams.

The Mustang Dyno showed peak at 315ish RWHP and 330ishRWTQ even though the printout was the last pull that was cut short since they were tweaking the mid range. Even at that the peak HP was 306 before they let off at 5300 and peak torque was 313 at 4900.

Pics and vids can be found at http://imageevent.com/driller/dyno2010

The HP was about what I figured but I was surprised by the torque curve.

 

The easiest way to get more usable power for a Lincoln is to go with a C head swap. Both the heads and intake provide much more low- and mid-range power which is much better for an automatic trans car. Some 96-98 cobra cams advanced about 6 degrees will increase both the hp and tq numbers also.