[4vFoxx]

OK guys here they are and some pics of how they were made, some additional photos similar to Joe's about how the disassembled tensioners look and where they go as you reassemble.

I started with a 1 ft length of 3/4" 095 wall, seamless 4130 tubing because that was the closest that McMaster had to the size i needed. This is the tubing from McMaster. Aircraft Spruce will be less expensive than McMaster for the same tube;

View attachment 141369

I started to clean up the end with Scotch-brite™ and then decided it would be easier in the lathe so this is how it looked after a few seconds and Scotch-brite™;

View attachment 141377

The next job was to face off the end to make it square and chamfer the edges prior to parting off a piece. This is the parting off operation;

View attachment 141385

After the parting off I broke the sharp edge next to the cut off and the job was complete. Repeat this one more time and you have two pieces. Total time was about 30 minutes plus clean up.

The spacers fit below the existing plunger as Joe has already indicated and prevent the chain tensioner from allowing the chain to go totally slack when the engine is shut down. This is a pic of how they fit into the tensioner assembly;

View attachment 141393

When you use the spacers the ratcheting plungers are no longer required.

There are a number of components in each assembly and as luck would have it they are different side to side. As a result I highly recommend you do one tensioner at a time and when you are done place it in a poly bag with all it's internals. Here is an exploded pic of most of the internals;

View attachment 141401

The right tensioner piston has a lubricating hole drilled in its top center. This piston will have a black plastic metering disc that goes into the inside top of the piston. The left tensioner piston will have no lubricating hole and no metering disc.

The ratcheting arm that we normally cut teeth off of is no longer required and can be discarded when you use the spacers beneath the tensioner piston. The metering valve you see in the pic below goes into the bottom of each piston well and is used to meter the volume of oil from the main galley that is fed to each piston to maintain chain guide pressure against the slack side of the primary drive chain.

View attachment 141409

If you happen to remove it in the modification process be sure to reinstall it prior to final assembly of the tensioner. The metering disc goes in with the pictured side facing the movable tensioning piston.

That's about it. This is not a particularly complex mod but it is a very good mod to do. The chain stretch at high engine speed or from a two step will cause the ratchet to extend on an unmodified tensioner and maintain tension on the primary drive chain as if it were stretched the way it was at high engine speeds - even after you shut off the engine.

That primary drive chain tension will squeeze the oil out of the #1 cam bearing saddle. The next time you start your engine you will have metal to metal contact until oil pressure can be restored to that journal. Repeated performances like this will eventually scar both the cam journal and the bearing saddle in the head. The next act in this unhappy show is the seizure of the #1 cam journal in the head. This is accompanied by the breakage of the primary drive chain and all the collateral damage the engine is capable of heaping upon your wallet.

Do the mod it is easy and the smart thing to do.

Ed

After removing the ratcheting plunger how is its spring loaded pawl removed? Or is this something that can just be left in the tensioner body without future worries?

 

[04DeadShort]

Well, Teksid blocks have the "pin stamp" or at least mine does. All my cylinders are Grade 2.

 

[eschaider]

After removing the ratcheting plunger how is its spring loaded pawl removed? Or is this something that can just be left in the tensioner body without future worries?

After removing the ratcheting plunger you can leave the pawl in place, Dave. It is easier and in the bigger picture does no harm. The actual pawl removal process is a PITA to do and really not worth the effort.

Be sure to do one tensioner at a time and keep all its parts in its own poly bag. The internals are slightly different from right to left side and you do not want to mix them up.

On balance this is a pretty easy job to do but do not mix up internals from side to side.

Ed

 

[67coupe]

Been following this thread for a while as my Termi swapped 89 LX might need a rebuild soon.

Joe,

Nice work! Cant wait to see the results after the tune. My current tune is from Eric Brooks, I might send you a PM later as your comment earlier has me concerned about his availability.

Now, why I decided to join the discussion. I used to work for a large OEM manufacturer in chassis and drivetrain department. If Ford's engine assembly process was/is similar to my previous employer, grading the bores was done to reduce time on the production line. The bores were measured and classified (1,2,3) as were the pistons. When the block arrived at the piston/con rod station, the line worker would select a piston for each bore based on it's classification by matching the numbers (1 for 1, 2 for 2, etc). This was a simple, fast way to ensure piston to bore clearance was acceptable while reducing assembly time and increasing production rates. I would assume all modern engine manufactures use this process.

Hopefully, I added some additional info to one of the most informative modular engine threads I''ve seen!

 

[04DeadShort]

^^^ that explains a lot. All about efficiency. I work in manufacturing so I can definitely relate.

 

[jrgoffin]

After removing the ratcheting plunger how is its spring loaded pawl removed? Or is this something that can just be left in the tensioner body without future worries?

Ed nailed it. I left the pawl in there figuring it was tucked out of the way and would just sit and do nothing. After seeing some of Ed's close-up pics of the serrated plug, it appeared to be too much hassle to dig it out. I had actually even forgotten about them until you brought this up!

Been following this thread for a while as my Termi swapped 89 LX might need a rebuild soon.

Joe,

Nice work! Cant wait to see the results after the tune. My current tune is from Eric Brooks, I might send you a PM later as your comment earlier has me concerned about his availability.

Now, why I decided to join the discussion. I used to work for a large OEM manufacturer in chassis and drivetrain department. If Ford's engine assembly process was/is similar to my previous employer, grading the bores was done to reduce time on the production line. The bores were measured and classified (1,2,3) as were the pistons. When the block arrived at the piston/con rod station, the line worker would select a piston for each bore based on it's classification by matching the numbers (1 for 1, 2 for 2, etc). This was a simple, fast way to ensure piston to bore clearance was acceptable while reducing assembly time and increasing production rates. I would assume all modern engine manufactures use this process.

Hopefully, I added some additional info to one of the most informative modular engine threads I''ve seen!

Thanks for chipping in!

I did add a paragraph about the Pin Stamp on my Castings page, and figured I could share more here again.

Along with the grade number of 1 - 3, they were also assigned a color code. Red (although I think it may have technically been Magenta) was for 1, blue for 2, and yellow for 3. At least I think I have the colors in the right order!

Here is a piston with both a paint daub and "Grade 3" on it:

This one here is from a set that has just a paint daub:

Here's even a rack of piston and rod assemblies from Romeo back in the day, but they don't all appear to have paint on them yet (unless the resolution isn't high enough to show it):

For another look at a Terminator engine being built on the Niche Line, there is still an archived article called Romeo Must Supply (<That should show up as a Hyperlink) that has some neat pictures. All very cool stuff for anyone interested in building their own engine, as well as seeing more of the history of the car. On that note, hopefully Terminator fans out there are grabbing their copy of the re-release of Iron Fist, Lead Foot: many more great pictures from Frank Moriarty that weren't in the first version!

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Edit: In case the Romeo Must Supply hyperlink isn't showing up, here's the direct link:

http://www.mustangandfords.com/how-to/engine/m5lp-0211-new-ford-mustang-cobra-engine/photo-gallery/

 

[4vFoxx]

After removing the ratcheting plunger you can leave the pawl in place, Dave. It is easier and in the bigger picture does no harm. The actual pawl removal process is a PITA to do and really not worth the effort.

Be sure to do one tensioner at a time and keep all its parts in its own poly bag. The internals are slightly different from right to left side and you do not want to mix them up.

On balance this is a pretty easy job to do but do not mix up internals from side to side.

Ed

Thanks Ed, this has been on my mind for the past week one more item checked off.

 

[Edmisten1]

For another look at a Terminator engine being built on the Niche Line, there is still an archived article called Romeo Must Supply (<That should show up as a Hyperlink) that has some neat pictures. All very cool stuff for anyone interested in building their own engine, as well as seeing more of the history of the car. On that note, hopefully Terminator fans out there are grabbing their copy of the re-release of Iron Fist, Lead Foot: many more great pictures from Frank Moriarty that weren't in the first version!

Good grief....the stuff you can find is amazing. That 'Romeo Must Supply' is a great article :good:

 

[jrgoffin]

Good grief....the stuff you can find is amazing. That 'Romeo Must Supply' is a great article :good:

It's nice to mix a little old in with the new: makes the story of these engines and the car that much more cool!

 

[eschaider]

Good grief....the stuff you can find is amazing. That 'Romeo Must Supply' is a great article :good:

I think Joe has a key to the back door at SVT and a few other places also, Jeff.

He finds stuff that I never even knew existed! If there was an award for detective work he would certainly finish at the top of that list. The information is, as you said, nothing short of amazing. BTW if you haven't taken a look see at his Terminator website you are missing a real treat. While you can't post to it, it is unquestioniably the most complete site about these cars and engines I have seen anywhere. As you already know from his build thread here, the way he documents and the clarity of his explanations is nothing short of superb.

Ed

 

[Edmisten1]

Oh yeah Ed, I've definitely perused his terminator site...many times actually lol. Like you say.... Amazing. His attention to detail is quite remarkable...

On another note, I sent Ed the piston from number 7 hole from my OEM engine, the one in the pic I posted early in this thread. If we're lucky, maybe he will comment on this thread for all to hear on exactly what the piston tells him. We've speculated that years of incipient detonation finally took its toll on the pistons as all 8 were damaged with 7 being the worst. But with it in his hands for him to inspect up close and personal, I thought that would be the best way to determine what we're looking at. But, alas, Ed is in Pomona at the winternationals. We'll have to wait until his safe return for the full report....

 

[jrgoffin]

Just was fortunate to have friends in low places! That, plus I've been hoarding pictures and documents for years, which then made organizing them a real chore. Glad everyone can enjoy all the stuff, along with this thread.

Safe travels to Ed: will be in his neighborhood later this week, so I'll get a full report out of him!

 

[Edmisten1]

Sweet. If you see him face to face, take a look at that Zollner piston for yourself...

 

[04DeadShort]

One thing I always wondered was why the t-56's has the weight on the pivot arm?

 

[mike69440]

I'm just wondering how does the latest Coyote 2015 Aluminator compares to the old Aluminator

Ford Racing 5.0l dohc Aluminator supercharger-ready crate engines M-6007-A50SCA



mike69440




Crazy SVT Poster
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Join Date: March 2002 Location: Northfield, NH Posts: 756

 

[jrgoffin]

Sweet. If you see him face to face, take a look at that Zollner piston for yourself...

Will definitely bring that up. Looking forward to what he'll have to say, which I imagine will also affirm his affinity for the Vampire!

One thing I always wondered was why the t-56's has the weight on the pivot arm?

I think it is a combination of weight/leverage, as well as a damper of some sort. I think plenty of guys have removed it with no adverse effect (easy to do so), but I left mine in. If you take yours out, let everyone know how it feels.

I'm just wondering how does the latest Coyote 2015 Aluminator compares to the old Aluminator

Ford Racing 5.0l dohc Aluminator supercharger-ready crate engines M-6007-A50SCA

Well, the first Aluminator 5.0 was a stroker short-block, using the 3V block and Eagle components. It was flexible enough to adapt 2V, 3V, or 4V heads and could be built in N/A or S/C fashion. Here's the specs on it: http://www.terminator-cobra.com/M_6009_A46X.pdf

The new Aluminator is based on the Coyote '15-up engine, which is complete. Lots of info out there on it.

http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=25250

 

[Wes Duenkel]

Once the pump and windage tray are on, it's time to add the pickup. The nice thing about this 3V block is the full-length tray - an "upgrade" over the standard 4V half-length tray. The ARP studs are also specific if you use the tray, and it bolts right back on easily. For guys that have a WAP block and want to add the 3V tray, it's inexpensive through Ford (about $25) as 4R3Z-6687-BA. Here's how it looks:

View attachment 135697

With regards to the pickup, the OEM Terminator (4V) version is pefect since the length allows it to sit about 1/4" above the pan bottom (also measured this with Silly Putty in my Canton pan). Additionally, it is considered a "high-flow funnel type" by Ford, so it never hurts to have the ability to get more oil up top. Here is a comparison picture with a newer style on the left (I have no idea why Ford made the change):

View attachment 135705

One caveat now with the 4V tube is the "scraper" that runs along the front edge. If you are using the full-length tray, it will have to be cut off, which is easy enough. As an alternative, the '05-'10 (3V) pickup will work since the depth is identical, but I believe it is the newer style as seen above left (this one in the picture is for the 5.8 Shelby). In any case, here is a side view of a new pickup - part of the scraper was simply removed with a cut-off wheel tracing the contour of the tube with about 1/2" clearance:

(Digging this one up from the dead)
Your comments about the "3V" windage tray and the incompatibility with the OEM Cobra pan make me wonder: I have an Aluminator long block from FRPP. It came complete from valve covers to the Cobra oil pan. I swapped back the OEM silver valve covers, but left the pan alone. I wonder if my Aluminator came with the 3V tray and a modified Cobra pan, or some other configuration. Any ideas?

 

[jrgoffin]

It could be that they tweaked the front scrapers, or it just has the '05-'10 GT pan. Only one way to find out, though, but probably not worth going to those extremes. I bet if you called FRPP and asked, they would still have the information as to all the parts that went in to the engine.

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Edit: Here's a pic of an original Aluminator long block, which does look to have the Terminator oil pan on it:

You can always look at the engineering number stamped on the bottom of the pan, which I believe was XR3E-6675-DB. If it's that pan, you just have a mystery of what they did with regards to making the windage tray work. If you aren't wanting to pop it off, I'd say just give FRPP a shout and hopefully they can tell you. Will be interesting to know!

 

[04cobrawhine]

This may be a silly question, but does all this apply to using a teksid block too? As in bearing part #s, torque specs ect?

 

[eschaider]

This may be a silly question, but does all this apply to using a teksid block too? As in bearing part #s, torque specs ect?

In a word, yes.

Most Teksids use a different side bolt arrangement but other than that, they end up quite similar to the Aluminator. Do not confuse an Aluminator block with a standard WAP block. The WAP block is not well suited to blown power levels above about 600 RWHP.

Ed