[04DeadShort]

Thats interesting Ed. I've always been told the WAP block was stronger than a Teksid. But that is forum racing to.....

 

[jrgoffin]

Thats interesting Ed. I've always been told the WAP block was stronger than a Teksid. But that is forum racing to.....

It's probably a good thing the WAP block never made it through the durability tests for the Terminator. The down side is the heavy iron block, but it was the best option at the time. All the details on the rest of the blocks are here:

http://www.terminator-cobra.com/castings.htm

 

[04cobrawhine]

In a word, yes.

Most Teksids use a different side bolt arrangement but other than that, they end up quite similar to the Aluminator. Do not confuse an Aluminator block with a standard WAP block. The WAP block is not well suited to blown power levels above about 600 RWHP.

Ed

Thanks Ed. I was most curious about the flanged thrust bearing more then anything.

 

[eschaider]

If you use the bearings Joe documented in his build thread you will have the flanged thrust you are looking for without having to machine the block.:beerchug:


Ed

 

[Edmisten1]

One thing I always wondered was why the t-56's has the weight on the pivot arm?

Can someone clarify exactly what this is...the pivot arm..?

 

[04DeadShort]

Yea man I'm sorry, I meant the clutch fork.

 

[markcass123]

Thanks for chiming in: it does seem that 85 ft/lbs is the magic number for the 2000 studs, and I'm sure I'll be content with that figure. Hope you don't mind me borrowing that picture - that was another one that was similar, but couldn't find it and figured yours would work just as well. Glad you were able to add some more to this for everyone's benefit!

Joe, I want to say thank you so much for this detailed write up. Really enjoying reading all this invaluable information before i continue building my teksid! I am playing catch up as you can see all the way back at page 4 but while this is fresh on my mind I just want to make a comment about all the discussion about different torque values etc.

In my experience with structural bolts (a325 / high strength structural bolts in bridges and steel erection from research done by companies like portland bolt) there is a ton of variables when torquing bolts ranging from thread friction, surface friction on the washer or head of bolt, oil existing from manufacturing the fastener, galvanized coatings etc, lube or non lubed and the calibration on your torquing device. Variance exists so much that in some tests with hundreds of bolts they see almost a 10-15% difference in clamping force. To me difference in 5 lb between 85 lb and 90 lb is very difficult to verify if you go from one install to the next I can almost guarantee you a difference of this magnitude would exist from install to install. In the field during bridge and steel erection we use washers called DTI washers that are essentially washers have dimples on the faces. As you tighten the bolt (no torque wrench required) the dimples on them compress and when the dimples are completely compressed this signifies to the installer that the bolt is in the correct elastic range of the bolt so you know the correct tensile force exists in the bolt and clamp force has been achieved. The correct tensile force is what keeps the nut from working its way off (has been proven better then lock washers or lock tight) or from "over-torquing". I just thought this was sort of a useful tidbit of knowledge as it may not necessarily be improper install or anything like that but you are simply subject to this randomness that is associated when working with torque values ! Any comments to disprove me or add are appreciated. Happy to be a new member of this forum as it seems there are some great builds going on !

Cheers !

 

[eschaider]

Your observations about the vagaries of tightening fasteners to a prescribed preload or stretch value are spot on Mark.

ARP has done some significant work in the area of fastener lube that really mitigates the problem. It is still important to keep the bottom of the washer dry and the top of the washer along with the fastener threads lubed. If you do this and use ARP UltraTorque lube you will repeat in a way that is at first uncanny and later after you have done it a number of times - expected.

When you do rod bolts the preferred method is measuring bolt stretch but still using UltraTorque as the lube.

Here are two excellent videos about ARP's UltraTorque product and its performance. One is by Horsepower TV and the other is by ARP. I think you will find both quite interesting;

and

The second video is more data centric while the first lets you see the testing process ARP uses.

Ed

 

[04cobrawhine]

If you use the bearings Joe documented in his build thread you will have the flanged thrust you are looking for without having to machine the block.:beerchug:

Ed

That's exactly what I wanted to hear! No maching to make them fit and much stronger. Thank you!

 

[Edmisten1]

Yea man I'm sorry, I meant the clutch fork.

Ok I thought that's what you meant but wanted to make sure. Thanks.

 

[jrgoffin]

Great ARP videos from Ed - well worth watching for anyone using their fasteners!

Thanks to Mark for chiming in as well. While I'll agree with you on the difference in torque being difficult to verify, especially from 85 ft/lbs to 90 ft/lbs, I still wanted to stay on the conservative side rather than push the upper limits. Here is a cross section of one of the Aluminator blocks that had the ARP studs run down to 100 ft/lbs, which ended up cracking the block (you can see the crack running down from the void in the bolt bore):

I don't know all the details on this one, but from what I read, it definitely stemmed from the high torque on the studs. Ed would probably have more info on this one, but in any case, I was content staying at 85 ft/lbs. I also won't forget that a re-torque of the studs is in order, but I haven't been in a mad rush.

Since the engine is essentially done save for final wiring of the Vampire and a tweak of the tune, there isn't a heck of a lot to report. I did decide to pull the AeroForce Wideband and go with a dual-bank setup, so I'll be starting on that over the weekend or early next week (I'll have to pull the mid-pipe back off - again - to have another bung welded in). The kit I went with is the Innovate 3891, which I picked up from a vendor on eBay for about $320.

Here's one of the gauge faces from their stock photo (the other is white):

Since I have the Interceptor on the steering column now (under the AutoMeter pod), that will be coming off. I've thought about the Speed of Sound pods, so I might be sending my OE A-pillar cover in to Alan there for modification, which is about $125. Being picky, I snagged a NOS cover to keep as a spare that was probably the last one in existence anywhere (so I was told), so I'll keep that one stashed away.

For anyone that goes this route, I figured it is worth noting that there were two different A-pillar covers in the Terminator (actually it was changed for all Mustangs later in the '03 run and in to '04). For anyone that doesn't want to have an original cover modified while searching for a spare to buy for this, here is a cross section of them (courtesy of the SoS site). Mine is the later one, which was Ford p/n 3R3Z-6303599-AAB (with the '3R33...' engineering number):

A couple generic pictures of the pillar with the dual 2-1/16" pods. Alan does a great job with these since the pod texture is a nice match to the OE texture along with the Dark Charcoal color, of course.

Also, since I still need to wire in the Vampire, I have been giving some thought to snagging the AEM harness (30-2980) so I can solder in the leads and make it a plug-and-play deal. I might also check with my local Ford guys to see if the PCM plugs are available through Motorcraft so I could possibly build this myself. If not, the AEM harness runs about $240.

More on this part of the project in the upcoming week.

 

[eschaider]

For those untrained eyes here is the same pic Joe posted but with dye penetrant to highlight the crack;

The dye penetrant makes the crack identification easier. For those who are block aficionados you will quickly recognize the block in the photo as one of the FRPP Aluminator blocks.

Even in the Aluminator blocks the amount of material at that location in the block is insufficient to withstand the tensile loads of ARP 2000 studs in the 100 ft/lbs and up torque category. What you are seeing is an ultimate strength failure in the block casting.

85ft/lbs is a very happy place to be when you are using ARP2000 studs.

Ed

 

[jrgoffin]

Thanks, Ed. I actually saved that picture as well, but just ended up using the one without the dye. All bases are covered now!

I also forgot to mention that I downloaded the Fuel System Calculator, so I'll be fiddling with that as well (even with everything on the conservative side here). For anyone that hasn't checked it out, of which I may have been one of the few, here's the direct link in the TToC: Fuel System Calculator.

It was definitely very cool seeing it live, and in action!!

 

[Wicked46]

Great ARP videos from Ed - well worth watching for anyone using their fasteners!

Thanks to Mark for chiming in as well. While I'll agree with you on the difference in torque being difficult to verify, especially from 85 ft/lbs to 90 ft/lbs, I still wanted to stay on the conservative side rather than push the upper limits. Here is a cross section of one of the Aluminator blocks that had the ARP studs run down to 100 ft/lbs, which ended up cracking the block (you can see the crack running down from the void in the bolt bore):

View attachment 144305

I don't know all the details on this one, but from what I read, it definitely stemmed from the high torque on the studs. Ed would probably have more info on this one, but in any case, I was content staying at 85 ft/lbs. I also won't forget that a re-torque of the studs is in order, but I haven't been in a mad rush.

Since the engine is essentially done save for final wiring of the Vampire and a tweak of the tune, there isn't a heck of a lot to report. I did decide to pull the AeroForce Wideband and go with a dual-bank setup, so I'll be starting on that over the weekend or early next week (I'll have to pull the mid-pipe back off - again - to have another bung welded in). The kit I went with is the Innovate 3891, which I picked up from a vendor on eBay for about $320.

Here's one of the gauge faces from their stock photo (the other is white):

View attachment 144313

Since I have the Interceptor on the steering column now (under the AutoMeter pod), that will be coming off. I've always liked the Speed of Sound pods, so I'll be sending my OE A-pillar cover in to Alan there for modification, which is about $125. Being picky, I picked up a NOS cover to keep as a spare that was probably the last one in existence anywhere (so I was told), so I'll keep that one stashed away.

For anyone that goes this route, I figured it is worth noting that there were two different A-pillar covers in the Terminator (actually it was changed for all Mustangs later in the '03 run and in to '04). For anyone that doesn't want to have an original cover modified while searching for a spare to buy for this, here is a cross section of them (courtesy of the SoS site). Mine is the later one, which was Ford p/n 3R3Z-6303599-AAB (with the '3R33...' engineering number):

View attachment 144321

A couple generic pictures of the pillar with the dual 2-1/16" pods. Alan does a great job with these since the pod texture is a nice match to the OE texture along with the Dark Charcoal color, of course.

View attachment 144329

View attachment 144337

Also, since I still need to wire in the Vampire, I have been giving some thought to snagging the AEM harness (30-2980) so I can solder in the leads and make it a plug-and-play deal. I might also check with my local Ford guys to see if the PCM plugs are available through Motorcraft so I could possibly build this myself. If not, the AEM harness runs about $240.

View attachment 144345

More on this part of the project in the upcoming week.

Joe, let me save you some time and let you know that all of the AEM PCM extensions are discontinued. Jegs and Summit still list them and so do some other dealers but they're no longer made by AEM. I also called AEM directly and spoke to a sales guy and an engineer about this. They no longer make them due to the connectors being obsolete. I asked the engineer fella for some part numbers (in hopes I can track down the connectors or pins to piece together my own) and they got defensive.

Long story short, I went to http://www.mass-air.com/Products.htm and picked up there 104 pin ECU extensions to wire in my Vampire. It's cheaper than what the AEM sold for and is a quality piece (all 20awg wire). Looking at the extension, both the male and female connectors are OEM ford connectors making it a sure fit for our needs. If you want any pictures of mine, let me know and i'd be happy to share. It's just sitting here in my parts room (aka, spare bedroom) lol

 

[jrgoffin]

Funny you mention that, Jon. After I made the post, I started digging around to see if I could find the connectors themselves, then stumbled on the IS&T website as well. I was glad to see they also sell the harness, but did not know AEM discontinued it since they are still listed in several places. Good to know! At least the other site does still have them, and the price is in the same range, so that helps. Now I just have to dig back behind the kick panel to see how much room I'll have to work with if I do go this route.

If you do want to share any pics, that would be great. I notice the one they show is just for the EEC-IV, but that is fine. Glad to see those guys still around - I remember them from the Fox Mustang days back in the '90's! For now, here is screen shot from their site:

Also found a vendor on eBay that lists 10 of the AEM version in case anyone needs one right away:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/AEM-30-2980...-Extension-Harness-/371539419481?hash=item568179a159:g:KtcAAOSwX~dWpABX&vxp=mtr

 

[Wicked46]

Joe - I just snapped these photos minutes ago...

 

[jrgoffin]

Thanks for the pics, Jon. From looking at the engineering numbers on each connector, it made me realize that someone willing to take some time could actually build one of these harnesses on your own. The same company had a listing for the male end on eBay right here for $60:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/250909352242?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

I also found these for $5 each. The engineering number ends in -AB rather than -AA, so I don't know if if that makes them incompatible, but it could be worth picking one up to examine (I'll keep digging in to this).

http://www.connectorpeople.com/Connector/FORD/F/F5SB-14A464-AB

The female end is theoretically the problem, but the engineering number makes it standard for all these EEC-V's. I think you could buy a junk EEC, remove the connector and wire it up after some modification. I've seen a lot of the computers on eBay also for around $25, so it might be possible to make this a DIY project quite inexpensively. Of course you have to do the labor, but the bang-for-the-buck factor might be pretty high.

Here's a decent picture of an EEC-V circuit board, so it looks like the connector is removed and trimmed so the wires can be pinned to it.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

EDIT - again...

Here's a better picture of the female connector (found them on eBay for $20 each):

It looks like some work with a dremel would be needed to trim the back of it (like the one Jon has), but it could be perfectly usable by just pulling the pins from the back and leaving the entire body in tact as it appears AEM did.

Here they are: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Amp-F5...32&meid=09c5337d9a524d5b8ce975b2dd7b0e3d&pid=100011&rk=3&rkt=10&sd=121556213184

 

[BLK_03]

You could also just cut one off a junkyard harness and depin, then repin it yourself.

I had to do that with the factory harness connector in the engine bay (in the corner by the passenger side hood hinge) after the dealership overtightened that bolt and cracked the connector.

 

[jrgoffin]

You could also just cut one off a junkyard harness and depin, then repin it yourself.

I had to do that with the factory harness connector in the engine bay (in the corner by the passenger side hood hinge) after the dealership overtightened that bolt and cracked the connector.

That thought did cross my mine, especially since I saw a harness end on eBay for $20. Since the new connector might be available for less than that, might grab one of those. If I decide to do this, just have to pick up some bulk wire (20 Gauge GXL like in Jon's up there) and pins, then it really should be a straightforward job. I mentioned to Ed that it may warrant another Build Thread, albeit a small one, but this could work out great for anyone that is willing to do it themselves.

 

[4vFoxx]

Is their enough room behind our kick panels for one of these extension harnesses?